Tuesday, July 30, 2013

Just The Facts Please "SHOW ME"

From Wikipedia

Hebrew Manuscripts

List of manuscripts (With note if it is or is not a complete Bible)

No complete Hebrew Bible from 600BC to 1008AD is in existence

Nash Papyrus, dated to the 2nd BC – 1st AD (Not the complete Bible)

  • Severus Scroll (named for the Roman Emperor who restored this scroll, reportedly seized from the Temple in Jerusalem, to the Jewish community in 220), a lost manuscript of early 1st century AD, only a few sentences are preserved by Rabbinic literature (Not the complete Bible)
  • Codex Hilleli, a lost manuscript of circa AD 600, destroyed in 1197 in Spain, only a few sentences are preserved by Rabbinic literature[8] (Not the complete Bible)
  • Codex Muggeh (or Muga)(="corrected"), lost, cited as a source in Massoretic notations. (Not the complete Bible)
  • Scroll 2, dated AD 1155-1255, University of Bologna Library (Not the complete Bible)

Here we are in 1155-1255AD and no actual proof that a complete Hebrew Bible is in existence. The Masoretic text will soon appear now with backward dating.

Masorah manuscripts
  • Codex Orientales 4445, dated between AD 820 and 850; the manuscript contains Genesis-Deuteronomy 1:33 (less Numbers 7:47–73 and Numbers 9:12–10:18). (Not the complete Bible)
  • Codex Cairensis, (Prophets) pointed by Moses Ben Asher, dated by a colophon AD 895 (the oldest ms bearing the date of its writing), (was in Cairo, now in Jerusalem) (Not the complete Bible)
  • Codex Babylonicus Petropolitanus, (Latter Prophets) dated AD 916Russian National Library (Not the complete Bible)
  • Aleppo Codex, AD 930, Museum Ben Zwi (Israel), (was complete, supposedly pointed by Aaron Ben Asher, partly destroyed in 1947); this ms is the basis of the Jerusalem Crown edition. (Not the complete Bible)
  • Codex Leningradensis, (complete) copied from a Ben Asher ms., dated AD 1008Russian National Library; this ms is the basis of the Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia and other editions. (First complete Bible but there are hundreds of differences in wording with prior partial existing MSS)
  • Michigan Codex, (Torah) 10th century[9] (Second complete Bible but there are hundreds of differences in wording with prior partial existing MSS)
  • Damascus Keter (Damascus Pentateuch), 10th century[10] (Third complete Bible but there are hundreds of differences in wording with prior partial existing MSS)
  • Reuchlin Codex (Prophets), dated AD 1105 (Fourth complete Bible but there are hundreds of differences in wording with prior partial existing MSS)
  • Codex Yerushalmi, lost, reportedly used in Spain (circa 1010) by Jonah ibn Janah(Lost so this one does not count)
  • Erfurt Codices (complete, Berlin), E1 circa 14th century, E2 possibly 13th century, E3 possibly 11th century (Fifth complete Bible but there are hundreds of differences in wording with prior existing MSS)
  • Codex Jericho, (Pentateuch) lost, cited in the notes to a Massoretic manuscript written circa 1310. (Lost so this one does not count)
  • Codex Ezra, lost, C.D. Ginsburg owned a manuscript written in 1474 which purported to have been copied from this. (Lost so this one does not count)
  • Codex Sinai, mentioned in Massoretic notes and reportedly used by Elia Levita (circa 1540). (Lost so this one does not count)
  • Codex Sanbuki (named for Zambuqi, on the Tigris River), lost, frequently quoted in Massoretic annotations and apparently seen (circa 1600) by Menahem Lonzano(Lost so this one does not count)
  • Codex Great Mahzor, lost, mentioned in Massoretic notes (the title suggests that this codex contained only the Pentateuch and those selections from the Prophets that were read during the liturgical year) (Lost so this one does not count)
  • Cairo Geniza fragments contains portions of the Old Testament in Hebrew and Aramaic, discovered in Cairo synagogue, which date from about 4th century AD (Not a complete Bible. The wording is different than other MSS)
  • Ben Asher Manuscripts. (Many of these are lost. What now remains is considered the true Jewish Bible. But it did not exist in the days of Jesus or the Apostles. The current Masorretic Text in Aramaic which is falsely called Hebrew, is the text many claim is the Hebrew. This Aramaic/Hebrew text did not exist prior to 800AD and had to be reconstructed from several different manuscripts. This MSS is the one vowel points were added to.)
Count up the actual full Bible MSS.
Count up the lost ones.

Now, which one existing today can anyone say existed in the days of Jesus and the Apostles?

I have ask this many hundreds of times: 

Show me the Hebrew Bible that existed in the days of Jesus and the Apostles. 

Show me the one today that is proven to be the one that existed in the days of Jesus and the Apostles.
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Dead Sea Scrolls

The Dead Sea Scrolls are not a complete Bible. There are scraps of MSS in different languages. 

We have no proof these scrolls are actual copies of an older Bible or translated from the Paleo-Hebrew. 

They appear to be in agreement with the Masoretic text invented between 800-1200AD. 

We do not know the true date of these scrolls and the dating is based upon faulty analysis on relics found in the caves. It is a certain fact that many of these relics could have been there hundreds of years before the caves were used as a bible making center. Some certainly date after the current accepted date of the scrolls. 

It is interesting that these caves and the extensive work carried out there by the scroll makers, is not mentioned on the list of Masoretic bible making sites. If it was not one of the recognized Masoretic sites, how then can scholars claim the scrolls are part of the Masoretic text transfer system? 

It could very well be that these Dead Sea Scrolls were written years later and the ones that seem to agree with the Masoretic text could be no older than 800AD themselves. 

A critical analysis is not welcomed because the 200BC-100AD dates are needed to give the Ben Ezra Masoretic text credibility.  

What I find strange in my own analysis, is that when the Pharisees met in the Council of Jamnia in 90AD to have Aquila write a new Greek translation, they did not know anything about the Dead Sea Cave Scriptoriums. This is hardly possible. It is totally unreasonable that they would know all the places Christians met and hid and used the Greek Septuagint but they would not know of an extensive scriptorium where a large number of people lived and used as a center for their activities. 

The large number of people who inhabited and frequented these scriptoriums, coming and going, they could not have been a secret. The Sicarri knew every secret place in Israel. This means the temple cult would have known. It also means those after 70AD would have known.

The question is, where is the Hebrew Bible they claim they faithfully preserved? They cannot prove its existence for hundreds of years. How did they lose it if they faithfully preserved it?

Where is a complete copy of it from 600BC to 1008AD? 

How come they cannot prove a complete copy existed in the time of Jesus and the Apostles? 

How come if a complete copy existed that Ben Ezra and his scribes must invent a new one from scratch from a collection of fragments gathered from several distant places. Do not lie and try to make the Ben Ezra the bible that existed in Jesus' day. That would be the same as saying the King James Version is what the Christians used in the first century (absurd).

How come there was no total and full copy in any one place for hundreds of years? 

The answer to these hard and difficult questions demands we ask one thing. 

Was there even in existence a complete Bible in the Aramaic (Hebrew) in the time of Jesus? 

We do know Josephus mentions 22 books. But this is way short of 39 +7 additional. But were these 22 collected into one volume of scripture in one book? So far the answer is no. 

If anyone has any proof of a complete Aramaic/Hebrew bible in the days of Jesus and the Apostles, I want to see it. I have asked for this bible for nearly 30 years now from bible scholars and so far none have provided that bible.
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Fables

We are asked to believe Jewish fables concerning the Masoretic text.
We are asked to believe they faithfully preserved the Aramaic/Hebrew bible but cannot produce it.
We are asked to believe they carefully copied every jot and tittle but cannot produce a single bible where these jots and tittles were written.
We are asked to believe they did not pronounce YHWH or YHVH because they did not want Gentiles or the profane to know how to and thus use it in vain.
We are asked to believe they lost the pronounciation and no one now knows it, but they use monk invented names such as Jehovah and Yahweh.
We are asked to believe the Aramaic/Hebrew language is the holy tongue of God.
We are asked to believe the numerology of this alleged sacred tongue unlocks the secrets of the Bible code.
We are asked to believe that anything any Jewish rabbi says is true, even if it disagrees with what Jesus or the Apostles said.
We are daily hammered to accept Jewish fables. It is time we reject any Jewish claim on interpretation of scripture that cannot be verified by Jesus or the Apostles.

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